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Author Topic: look out ...... PERMITS FOR DETECTRISTS  (Read 5875 times)
handyman [Alan}
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« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2009, 09:45:47 PM »

some good posts in reply to my post and i thank you all for that.

i anticipated the alternative repsonse and appreciate the time taken to put forward your comments. i think we have to start with the questions, 'what are the reasons for taking up the hobby and why?'

we also need to consider the heritages position and that is how do we ensure that our heritage is recorded to the benefit of the future researchers. The PAS is a step in the right direction, however there are many many detectorists who have their own private collections which have not been recorded anywhere.

there is also the concern of the selling of our heritage where the artefacts [which haven't been recorded] could end up abroad, lost forever.  

this raises the question of how do the authorities and the hobby groups, can work together to ensure a high degree of professionalism from  both sides. if this involves regulation then so be it. i am convinced that this is more liely to happen as more and more people take up the hobby without even considering their responsibilites in recording finds.

isn't it a shame that so many wonderful and personal private collections, will probably never ever see the light of day by joe public. i find that aspect very sad, as in most cases the collection is likely to be sold off at the end of a persons life.

anyway, keep the comments coming and maintain the politeness in the posts.

cheers

alan
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« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2009, 09:58:11 PM »

Hallo Alan.... Before joining DW.com  I had never heard of the FLO or the treasure act or anything at all to do with reporting a potential historical find..... my point here mate is that maybe a little education is whats needed for new folks taking up the hobby.... to encourage the hobby but also protect our herritage ...... i will be honest mate if i had found an old gold coin it would be sitting upstairs now in my coin box and not reported or anything , simply because i didnt know what to do  Undecided  Good job you guys and ladies, thanks for what ive learned so far   Wink
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handyman [Alan}
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« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2009, 10:01:24 PM »

i agree with the idea of a training programme for all detectorists who wish to take up\ the hobby -- perhaps thats the way forward, one must do such a course before being issued with a permit which allows them to by a detector!!

thank you for making your point, it's a very valid one
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Tinman (paul/Lisa)
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« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2009, 10:04:57 PM »

sounds nuts to me sorry for being so blunt but it does. Anyway who watches the watcher?
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simon c
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« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2009, 10:06:53 PM »

Allan if you read the recent amendments to the Coroners act and the future amendments to the Treasure Act these fears of yours are allready being tackled,quite a few changes to tackle the selling of artifacts,As for these amazing collections we have hidden away i wish i had one,lol,most of the finds that a lot of us make are under 200 years old and of little interest to the PAS scheme.How many museums have vaults full of items never seen buy the public,and they really do have some amazing PRIVATE collections. Smiley
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handyman [Alan}
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« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2009, 10:10:37 PM »

i agree simon, i am very concerned about the closure of rural museums by local authorities - who in return sell of [via auction] the artefacts which in some cases were, or are, on permanent loan.

there are quite a few archives being closed by local authorities as they struggle to balance their books.

again, thank you for taking time to reply, it is much appreciated and adds another aspect to the discussion.

cheers
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Tafflaff (Rob)
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« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2009, 11:17:44 PM »

Going back to the article (read this excerpt below)

Quote
As has been highlighted in the news this week, metal detecting is more popular than ever. And with treasure hunter Terry Gilbert reputed to be in line for a seven figure sum for a hoard of Anglo-Saxon gold he found earlier this year, the trend looks set to continue. While landowners stand to take 50% of any treasure found, they also have the potential challenge of large numbers of people digging up their property.

They only have "the potential challenge of large numbers of people digging up their property" if .

a] They give permission for large numbers of detectorists to detect on their land.

b] Nighthawkers decide to target their land.

The first one is a no brainer - don't give permission to large amounts of detectorists. the second problem is nothing at all to do with the majority of Detectorists as we always gain permission. As has been previously stated, in this thread, a permit will only affect the law abiding detectorists, not the nighthawkers.

Nighthawking is Tresspass and should be dealt with by the police. Taking artifacts whilst Nighthawking is theft and again should be dealt with by the police. No different than the theft of a Tractor or any other item of farm paraphernalia.

Registering our finds on the other hand is a totally different story and needs a different plan of attack, I don't see how making someone buy a permit will affect their decision on wether to disclose their find to a F.L.O. It is a problem that needs addressing though because its down that road the attack will come from , when (not if) it comes



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Al.Thepastfinder, ( Alan )
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« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2009, 08:38:58 AM »

This is just one of the big problems they have Lovedoc,  who's going to police it,  where's the extra money coming from ect ect,  as Mike said, a charge for the permits will follow,  but that money won't cover it,
Alan
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sodbuster
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« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2009, 03:23:46 PM »

              I personally object to being called a "treasure hunter" ,and  I think this is a term , that does not fit well with most " detectorists.  A detectorist and a treaure hunter are two different things in my book . I go detecting to find pieces of history that in some small way add to the origins of all of us , if by luck I stumble across something of great value , then great , thats a bonus . I have never sold anything that I have recovered. A treasure hunter to me is someone who is solely out to make money from the hobby , which is usually were the bad press comes from .   
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handyman [Alan}
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« Reply #24 on: November 27, 2009, 04:45:13 PM »

that was a well thought out and constructed reply Rob, thank you.

alan [sodbuster] - i too have concern over the use of the name treasure hunter. i think this seriously detracts from the good name and actions that many detectorists, hold.

the issue of selling for personal gain, is one that will be debated over many years to come. everyone will have their own views on the matter. Rob's point about recording is a serious one. How do we educate those who take up the hobby in their roles and responsibilities in recording finds, 10 fig grid refs etc. Portable Antiquity scheme, The treasure Act, role of coroners,  etc etc.

Al [pastfinders] comment about policing the hobby and the extra costs involved, is well made.

keep the comments coming, this is turning into a very interesting debate.

cheers


[yet another] Alan
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« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2009, 05:37:16 PM »

Quite a debate.

The rank and file metal detectorist out in all weathers and mostly producing buttons and buckles with the occasional hammy, ummm !

I think once these so called treasure hunters who think that on every farmers field lies  a fortune, faces the reality of what is mostly found, quite a few will give it up !

As for scheduled monuments being attacked by night hawkers surely thats for English heritage etc to provide there own security ! It maybe against the law, howmany signs are displayed saying ' no detecting ' !  

I also agree it is up to the landowners who or howmany detect on his land, it isnt up to a club to dictate where people detect.

If the courts wont prosecute and or make examples of culprits like recent cases, there is no deterrent.

I agree with others, I like being independant, and dont see why I should be regulated and have to join a club.

Though having to buy a pemit only highlights that you detect, doesnt watch your finds or what is done with them, or where you are detecting.

Its a little like the gun licences, made life difficult for the law abiding, didnt stop the thugs getting their guns though !

When you view all forums and see the artefacts / coins found, one does wonder what happens to these finds, when really and truely most should be in a museum  Grin.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2009, 05:43:28 PM by outlaw » Logged

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