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Author Topic: Pick on the detectorists  (Read 38636 times)
Kev
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« on: September 05, 2013, 07:40:21 PM »

This is not nice...........

http://www.dw.de/uk-treasure-hunters-make-archeologists-see-red/a-17066960
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gesza
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« Reply #1 on: September 05, 2013, 08:18:14 PM »

give him a metal detector he will soon change his mind  Angry
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me who dares wins ?
probono
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« Reply #2 on: September 05, 2013, 08:35:26 PM »

It's quite obvious from the article he doesn't understand anything about where metal detecting artifacts come from usually (the ploughsoil horizon) and also assumes (like quite a few people I know) that you can only be a detectorist if you are uneducated - he's also Greek if you look at his LinkedIn profile and so has brought his ideas with him from his previous occupations.

I must admit that, for me, his assumption that we are all uneducated is the most outrageous suggestion - metal detecting (like many hobbies) has people from a broad range of backgrounds - but then as an Oxford graduate I know that people from Cambridge can be quite stuffy at times.......
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celticspikey
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« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2013, 07:22:50 AM »

Why not report on the hundred and hundreds of skeletons archaeologists lift from the ground... and thus from there designated burial place,  only to be thrown into a cardboard box and stored for a privileged few to occasionally examine from time to time Angry Angry he knows very little about metal detecting, and yet our museums are full of ancient objects recovered by us, for the public to enjoy and learn from Wink.And now I am out to find some more Grin Grin Grin
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Goldpanner
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« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2013, 07:37:31 AM »

Why not mention the hundreds of coins and antiquities that go 'missing' from many museums storerooms every year?

« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 07:39:05 AM by Goldpanner » Logged
celticspikey
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« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2013, 08:05:08 AM »

 
Why not mention the hundreds of coins and antiquities that go 'missing' from many museums storerooms every year?


Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Wink
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Pon
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« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2013, 09:05:26 AM »

Hmm a surprising read, You do have to question why some sections still feel the need to write such things.
Yes you could mention the amount of artefacts, coins and other antiquities that get "lost" whilst in the care of museums etc but two wrongs dont make a right.
I dont believe for one second that he is talking about the vast majority of responsible detectorists who follow the guide lines set down, report their finds and promote the hobby in the way that it was intended.
I would imagine like a lot of archaeologists his perception of the hobby is based on the few that go out at night without permission and do nothing of any use for Archaeologists and metal detectorists a like. Perhaps tougher sentencing when caught would go some way to help this??

All those years ago when I read about the introduction of the PAS, naively I thought this would go a long way to building bridges between Archaeologists and Metal Detectorists. In some circles I'm now begining to wonder if this is the case?  I still have over 40 finds waiting to be added to the database. The vast majority of them Roman, most I have already identified and yet upto 9 months later there is till no record of them on their website.
Just playing Devils advocate here but is the PAS doing all it could to promote this wonderful hobby??  

All we can do as responsible detectorists is continue to promote the hobby in the way that it should be,  
« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 02:54:06 PM by Pon » Logged

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Chef Geoff
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« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2013, 09:59:53 AM »

Wise words indeed Pon Wink
I think you have to take this archaeologists area of expertise into consideration  "Archaeologist and illicit antiquities researcher", he is seeing or studying the worst of the worst cases and in the same way that if most of us worked in a refuge for battered women, it wouldn't take long to come to the conclusion that all men should be licensed or castrated.
It is highlighting the very real danger areas but is not a giving a balanced picture also remember that this article has not been written BY the archaeologist and therefore the journalist has to use quotes to build a story, her final comment,
 "And unless laws change soon in the UK, stories like his are sure to inspire even more hunters to grab a metal detector and hit the fields"
is all hers and thereby tells a tale.
These articles and the "shock horror" response they always receive have been going around and around since metal detecting became popular and do nothing to advance either sides views or heal wounds.
As Pon says,
"Just playing Devils advocate here but is the PAS doing all it could to promote this wonderful hobby"
personally "no" I don't think they are but lack of funds stop any advancement in this area.
The same question could, in my view, be asked of the NCMD, they are conspicuous in their silence on promoting a more professional image for the hobby. I view them a little like the country viewed the late Winston Churchill, he was a great leader in time of war but the country soon got rid of him when it was over, they still seem to be sitting in their slit trenches with their tin hats on when many others have shaken hands with the "enemy" and realise we can not only offer them something but learn a great deal by cooperating.
NCMD need to either be replaced or at the least get a serious makeover, their website is as about as modern or exciting as listening to a 50 year old shipping report, they do not release membership numbers or release any financial accounts to it's members Roll Eyes
As I have said before these threads always evoke polarised views, the answers, if there are any, are to be found in a middle ground that has been fashioned by debate not insult.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 10:24:00 AM by Chef Geoff » Logged
Pon
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« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2013, 10:34:59 AM »

"
The same question could, in my view, be asked of the NCMD, they are conspicuous in their silence on promoting a more professional image for the hobby.
  A great point. I raised a similar issue on another metal detcting forum questioning what they stood for and the support they give. the post was deleted within minutes of it being posted.
Sadly they always seem to remain silent when the oportunity arises to defend the hobby in a more positive light.
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You can always tell a Black Country kid. You just can't tell him much!
carling2
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« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2013, 10:54:11 AM »

oh jeez not this, oh we are all getting the flak again  Shocked,,the term a victim of your own success comes to mind,,,show hoards ,gold and silver,show 2000 year old objects and let the gullable general public believe this happens on a regular basis,,then yes you are going to be on the receiving end of criticism,,,if you showed the normal dross of ring pulls bits of tin and lead ,,would people bat as eyelid {no} they would just put you down as a harmless fruitcake with nothing better to do.
but when all organised rallys say, oh the area is medieval/roman and then shout it from the rooftops when anything half decent turns up then again its going to raise a few eyebrows ,,yes the media love it,,detecting manafactures love it,but it leaves jo blogs the ordinary tectorist again in the spotlight ,,as long as your digging holes and broadcasting what you've found youll always get the stick off somebody or another.
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Spooyt Vane
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« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2013, 02:04:26 PM »



We as a club  helped out on a abbey excavation and recovered 14 hammered from the spoilheaps...We marked all metal signals on site before excavation....Even with good seiving it was virtually impossible to spot the coins amongst the crumbled roof slate on site...But we noted the areas where they failed to find the signal and retrieved it from the soil heaps...Most non ferrous they found had good shape and colour....The coins were hardly ever found by the excavators ,but they were most important for dating levels....When i was up on Hadrians Wall looking at the excavations,i was astounded that metal detectors were banned from the site by English Heritage...Thats very short sighted and the site director agreed with me...But his hands were tied...There is a lack of common ground in some areas and nighthawks let this hobby down   Angry
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Pon
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« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2013, 02:20:45 PM »



There is a lack of common ground in some areas and nighthawks let this hobby down   Angry
I couldnt agree more Rob, This is where (in my own opinion) The PAS & the NCMD just dont do enough. The PAS more so than the NCMD are in a perfect position to unite us all for the common good. At this moment in time I see very little evidence of them doing so.

Likewise as Geoff has already eluded to, the NCMD seem to be more than happy to just sit back and pick up insurance/membership subscriptions, and from what I can see do very little in return. There have been plenty of opportunities where they could have spoken up and at the very least  published a statement regarding illegal detectorist, night hawking etc yet they remain anonymous.....
I'm on my soap box now....sorry everyone but this really is a sore subject with me Smiley
« Last Edit: September 06, 2013, 03:01:43 PM by Pon » Logged

You can always tell a Black Country kid. You just can't tell him much!
anthonyjay
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« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2013, 04:15:51 PM »

Reference to the NCMD;  There has been a change in their top people and because of this new policies are being made which seems a drastic step backward after all the hard work done in the early years by the likes of Trevor Austen. It is alleged that they are no longer interested in the PAS and have severed any ties there may have been.
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Goldpanner
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« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2013, 04:19:30 PM »

What with many UK clubs being full and not even taking anyone onto a waiting list, could it be time for a new organisation?
An organisation which is basically one large club with separate county clubs, with the whole, being a pressure group for the Hobby?
Public Liability Insurance isnt a problem as I already have it standing by for my Goldpanning club and Forum#
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carling2
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« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2013, 05:17:39 PM »

 Angry going on about how the pas system dosent work as it should {yet many support and contribute to it} talk of trying to organise a different governing body for tectin,,why ,, detectin hasn't changed since the hobby started and its always has criticism from many quarters so any current or future voice of detecting will only go over the same old talk,,,yes we have nighthawks and will continue to do so,,yes we have a large percent of tectorists that do not work with the pas and will continue to do so ..yes we tread the same old ground literally etc etc
it will still not stop the criticism of the hobby and isn't it really just about tectorists trying to find a universal reason to take things out of the ground to do with whatever they please?
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