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Title: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 24, 2017, 06:11:17 PM Hi everyone,
I bought this Queen Anne coin from ebay the other day, listed as a detecting find. At the time of buying it I did not scrutinize the pictures but I got it a few days ago and today as I had a spare moment, I have had a closer look at it, and now feel that this coin could be forged? For one it feels in the hand fairly light for its size, its a sixpence. Also the edges, am I right in saying this should appear milled, a bit like a William III sixpence or similar, where the outer edge (side) is grooved all the way round? If so this is smooth and angled, I don't know why I didn't spot this before, what should an Anne sixpence weigh? My first Queen Anne and its a forgery (I think), any thoughts. Merry Xmas to all! Jon Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Dale on December 24, 2017, 06:56:59 PM Hi jtalbot0001
If it fills wrong in the hand it probley is, the line all around the edge is from the two part mould it's easy made, they normally file the edge away and tone to create the old look. It's probley cast in pewter as it has a low melting point sometimes they add a little lead to get the weight and fill right. It's a great shame people do this, there's so many about now. Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 24, 2017, 07:22:24 PM Hi Dale,
Thanks for your input. I am going to open a case in ebay, but just in case there are any issues, do you know how long this technique has been used for? IE do you think this coin was made in last 5 years or is it possible to have been made 10 to 15 years ago? Put it this way, the guy said he found it 10 to 15 years ago, so either he is completely lying about that fact or somebody thought it clever to chuck this in a field and he found it back then. Using a magnifying glass I cannot see any dirt of any kind, only black 'stuff' which I presume then has come from casting? Jon Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: celticspikey on December 24, 2017, 07:45:13 PM 1703-11....3 grms...yours has unusual wear paterns, edges dodgy aswell as stated...it's a shame there's plenty of fakes on e bay unfortuantly......
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Dale on December 24, 2017, 08:40:01 PM heres one I found in ebay sold items, that coin of yours has never been in the ground, its toned in a way to show its been handled.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1707-Retro-Sixpence-Souvenir-Gap-Filler-Same-size-as-original/282665771767?hash=item41d03162f7:g:J-EAAOSwi2lZi~x0 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1707-Retro-Sixpence-Souvenir-Gap-Filler-Same-size-as-original/282665771767?hash=item41d03162f7:g:J-EAAOSwi2lZi~x0) Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 24, 2017, 10:58:01 PM Hi Dale,
Thanks for the link! I have opened a case and the buyer as absolutely refused a refund on the first reply (which tells me he already knew), so unfortunately this is going to take a while to resolve, as it gets escalated through ebay. I will keep this post updated so others can see what happens if they are in the same situation with ebay. I may use your link Dale if needs be. Jon Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 24, 2017, 11:55:09 PM I have just stumbled on another forgery, exactly the same die!! Note the worn area in the centre of this copy on ebay is same as mine, also the edges are not milled.
When my case is being handled with the help of ebay I will inform them of this one too! http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Great-Britain-Sixpence-1707-UK-Queen-Anna/192403274951?_trkparms=aid%3D777003%26algo%3DDISCL.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49138%26meid%3Df1a6776c7e3741dd9dca292ec05dd39e%26pid%3D100012%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D282665771767&_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Great-Britain-Sixpence-1707-UK-Queen-Anna/192403274951?_trkparms=aid%3D777003%26algo%3DDISCL.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49138%26meid%3Df1a6776c7e3741dd9dca292ec05dd39e%26pid%3D100012%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D282665771767&_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985) Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Dungbeetle on December 25, 2017, 12:33:17 AM I have just stumbled on another forgery, exactly the same die!! Note the worn area in the centre of this copy on ebay is same as mine, also the edges are not milled. If you read the description of this coin it states that it was made after the date and is a reproduction.When my case is being handled with the help of ebay I will inform them of this one too! [url]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Great-Britain-Sixpence-1707-UK-Queen-Anna/192403274951?_trkparms=aid%3D777003%26algo%3DDISCL.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49138%26meid%3Df1a6776c7e3741dd9dca292ec05dd39e%26pid%3D100012%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D282665771767&_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985[/url] ([url]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Great-Britain-Sixpence-1707-UK-Queen-Anna/192403274951?_trkparms=aid%3D777003%26algo%3DDISCL.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49138%26meid%3Df1a6776c7e3741dd9dca292ec05dd39e%26pid%3D100012%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D282665771767&_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985[/url]) Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 25, 2017, 09:50:08 AM Thanks for pointing that out, I only read the Title and Condition section, neither mention the fact it's a reproduction. However, this listing helps me even better in that it proves my copy is indeed a fake.
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: nobby on December 25, 2017, 01:52:03 PM Hi John
As an ebay seller your case won't stand I'm afraid :( BUT leave negative feedback!!! I can't stand traders who do this sort of thing!! >:( Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: probono on December 25, 2017, 02:25:26 PM I look at ebay a lot - there seem to be even more fakes than ever at the moment.
I remember once when I saw some coins on eBay that I had previously owned sold as 'metal detecting finds' - I certainly hadn't found them myself, or bought them from a detectorist - the seller had bought them from the person I sold them too, who then got cross with me for 'messing with his business'. Often people only put 'metal detector find' because apparently people pay a premium for that. I really wish eBay was stricter with fake sellers (although I notice that Saxby's has gone quiet). = I'm buying much less of the place nowadays. Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: paulpop on December 26, 2017, 02:28:42 AM you dont need proof , just say its '' not as described '' open a not as described case in the resolution centre and eventually ebay will refund you - there is no such thing in british law and ebay rules as no returns , uk law states you have 7 days after the day you recieve the item thruogh the post and ebay rules states you have 30 days - if a seller says no returns they say this to disencourage you to send something back - if you have any problems let me know i'm an expert on ebay policies
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Val Beechey on December 26, 2017, 08:35:57 PM Depending on how much you paid for it Jon, is worth the hassle. Might be better to put down to the learning curve.
Negative feedback is very effective. Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: nonker10 on December 27, 2017, 03:51:20 PM a freind of mine showed me a queen anne half crown in georgius condition that he bought off a local market trader for a few quid which he thought maybe a fake.to me everything seemed good about the coin but if you looked at ann's cheek there was a slight look of copper showing through.i put it on e bay with the details as stated because i didn't know if it was a contemporary forgery and would leave it to the people that knew about these things.it sold for about 4 quid.so i guess quite a modern forgery.
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Landyman on December 29, 2017, 09:39:00 AM I hope this shilling is real!
Found it yesterday. First Queen Ann coin for me. Only been looking for 23 years lol. Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: dingdong on December 29, 2017, 10:56:42 AM Congratulations Landyman..very nice specimen coin,well detected and saved... wishing you a very happy and prosperous new year...and good hunting..👍
P.S:And many thanks for posting👍 Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: probono on December 29, 2017, 12:05:46 PM Can you add a picture of the other side too please! (And maybe a bit bigger images).
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 29, 2017, 07:10:28 PM Thanks for all the comments so far.... As for the hassle, I don't care how much I paid for it, it's a matter of principle. As Nonker stated in his comment, if you list an item and state it as such, then that is fair, but when the person lies and states "it was a metal detecting find from 10/15 years ago" and does not state anywhere in the listing that it is modern forgery - and those two points don't tie up, how can they, then I was sold a coin under false pretenses. So watch this space.
And congrats on finding the real deal Landyman, can't question that coin at all! Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: nobby on December 29, 2017, 08:39:03 PM Keep us informed on the outcome john ;)
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Landyman on December 30, 2017, 09:44:22 AM Can you add a picture of the other side too please! (And maybe a bit bigger images). Ere yer go. Was you joking when asking for bigger images? I thought they were too big lol. Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: nonker10 on December 30, 2017, 05:18:51 PM wow that's a beaut landyman.i've only found one queen anne in 35 years of detecting and thats a worn sixpence love token.so well done mate. ;)
Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery UPDATE Post by: jtalbot0001 on December 31, 2017, 04:04:07 PM Hi All,
I had to wait a few days to sort out my issue with the seller, as he point blank refused, before ebay is brought into the case to resolve it, it took less than 3 hours for ebay to come back to me and they have automatically refunded me. IE they refund me and then deal with the seller later to get back the money. So if the seller says they wont refund you, in the listing or otherwise, that is meaningless, if you have a strong case, as in my example, then don't hesitate to make a case. So all in all, a happy ending, although a rather drawn out one. Wishing everyone a Happy New Year! Jon Title: Re: Queen Anne forgery? Post by: Dungbeetle on December 31, 2017, 04:21:19 PM That's a good result, well done
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