DetectingWales.com

I have my own insurance cover for shooting and recreational activities on farmland. would my personal insutance be accepted if i attend a rally with this forum?
i ask this question because i have been invited as a guest on a club rally being done by the celtic searchers from llanelly who my friend is a member of and they are willing to accept my insurance but my friend has advised me to get fid or ncmd which are accepted by all detecting clubs.
Which insurance company does this forum recommend or would my personal cover be ok?

fid or ncmd cover is recomended as cover for metal detecting and can be obtained online easily at a very reasonable yearly price

for £10 a year i wouldn't take a chance with other insurance and if your an O.A.P £8 per year  :D
http://fid.newbury.net/html/memlet.htm (http://fid.newbury.net/html/memlet.htm)

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This is not the current address for the FID CS, Unfortunately Colin died and now Richard Evans runs the new FID.CS

http://www.fid.org.uk/ (http://www.fid.org.uk/)

Hope this helps.

If you want an alternative look up NCMD who also provide cover for metal detecting.

As chairman of a small detecting club in Brecon I doubt I would be comfortable if detectorists started providing alternative polices .

Although no fan of the NCMD their insurance/membership is slightly better value in what you get, the insurance is public liability not personal anybody who has a mortgage probably has this but a rally would never get under way if the organisers had to pour over insurance policies ;D Ironically if you follow the various codes of conduct regarding closing gates, filling holes and taking rubbish home the chances of an accident happening are so minute as to not be worth considering and if it can be proved, and therefore blamed, that an accident is a result of ignoring the above then you won't be covered anyway  ;)

So from reading your post are you stating in reality, both these avenues of metal detecting insurance do not cover you in the event of a landowner making a claim against someone carrying out detecting on there land ???????

As that is how I read your post, which although the odds of a claim being instigated is as you state minimal, it could happen ! :o

I will also add as an edit, I have never ever heard of anyone actually making a claim  :D

It would also be very interesting and informative for these insurance policy organisations to comment on your post.

No I've never heard of a claim either and in almost 40 years I've never been asked about insurance though I always have it. As for cover it does deal with metal detecting but it's difficult to envisage the circumstances that an accident has happened when you have followed the "rules" and many of the scenarios you can think of are covered by the "Act of God" clause personally I think the cover is more a comfort blanket rather than of any use but as many of us know :-[ insurance is always a waste of money until the day you need it.
As for needing it for rallies this is even more random as how the hell you can apportion blame to one person as a result of a rally of say 100 people beats me ;)

I have to go out to work and will comment later.

I find that post extremely worrying. Lax to approach any farmer/ landowner and claim everyone attending is covered by an appropriate insurance when in fact  any organisation setting up rallies by your statement do not really know or are they checking attendee's.

I would hope fid / ncmd and will certainly contact them for assurances that their polices do cover me and my members of our club for the hobby. ::)

They may well know who is attending and have checked their insurance but lets look at a theoretical scenario...... A rally is held where everybody attending has insurance, two weeks later the farmers prize bull manages to break its leg in a hole that's obviously been dug and has to be shot or an expensive racehorse cuts its frog on a sharp piece of old iron left next to a filled hole and bleeds to death the farmer now contacts the organiser and the organiser does what ??? how can they say who dug the holes?
Public liability insurance does cover negligence but if it can be proved that it was "criminal negligence" or "criminal damage" then your on your own :-\ If you have dug a hole then dutifully filled it in only for those pesky rabbits to come along and pull the plug out, which they have a nasty habit of doing around here, then you're covered but short of strapping bunny in to a chair and interrogating him I'm not sure how you'd prove it ;D

I think the most valuable part of insurance is when looking for land to detect on, Show the farmer your NCMD/FID card and this will totally change his/her view, as far as they are concerned it changes you from a nighthawk to a responsible detectorist. give it a try next time!

Surely NCMD & FID would have a clause somewhere in the small print that says they cover Rallies providing all attending have their insurance.

Which raises a small point.  Who is supposed to check cards on DW Rallies.

val i think i'm correct in saying insurance is recomended not manditory

last year i raised the question of insurance on here for metal detecting and was roundly shot down , but i will repeat what i was told by one of the 2 companys usually mentioned,  when i asked it what would be covered ? the person said after i pressed a bit  "virtually nothing" , i also had a lawyer friend take a quick look and it is worthless , the lloyds syndicates  call this kind of policy easy money ie no risk they will never pay anything out

now it could be said that for a tenner its worth having anyway can't argue with that , but you may as well just chuck that tenner in the fire

I am sure i will be shot down again,  so i will leave it at that ,but  might be worth asking the question how much in claims they have actually paid out,  if its above 0  i will be very surprised , you could argue yes but one day it might but dont hold your breath

In all the rallies I have attended to date across the uk since 2004,  I cannot ever remember being asked to show proof of insurance  ???
Quote
I think the most valuable part of insurance is when looking for land to detect on, Show the farmer your NCMD/FID card and this will totally change his/her view ]as far as they are concerned it changes you from a nighthawk to a responsible detectorist. give it a try next time!end of Quote.


I would have thought the most valuable part of having a detecting insurance is that it covers you from all outcomes that might occur whilst out detecting, it may well help a land owner to decide whether he wants he or she detecting on  land. Night/day hawking is a criminal act and has nothing to do with the original thread ! I would advise everyone to show insurance proof when trying to obtain permission.

After reading Chef's last reply I can quite understand the logics of his point of view. It may well end up that in future all organisers of rallies will need a blanket insurance. I will however out of curiosity contact both Fidcs and Ncmd for them to explain the extent of cover. ;)

here's the link to last years thread ... but i can't see any evidence of being shot down !!

http://www.detectingwales.com/index.php?topic=22930.msg209493#msg209493 (http://www.detectingwales.com/index.php?topic=22930.msg209493#msg209493)

Well apologies to be like a dog with a bone  ;D

But but, just read the link to the previous thread thank you Alan.

Perhaps showing your insurance to a land owner is misleading if it doesnt benefit him just the detectorist.  ::)

And to presume the landowner has cover for detectorists maybe presumptious !

This is an interesting thread and should be discussed with insurance companies so that the issue of who can claim what is resolved. ???

Many thanks for that last thread outlaw,if indeed that could be set out (IN LAY TERMS)then I think we all could breath a sigh of relief.
Because at the moment I'm confused !!!,mind you it doesn't take much these days !! ???

Well M8, I do not think you are alone (confused that is ) lol

Many of us have been paying insurance to either the FID now FIDCS or NCMD,for a number of years and have assumed we are covered for the hobby,
 to read statements that the policy probably only covers the detectorist would mean everytime we show our cards to a farmer, we might be misleading him into thinking he is covered also by our insurance.

As a detectorist  and I consider myself to be responsible one, will investigate this further and post up my findings at a later date.

In all probabilities it will result in a more costly insurance policy, or organisers of large rallies will charge more to cover blanket insurance costs.

Thanks for that alan,  but that was n't the thread  i was refering to. 

it may of been another thread subject but it turned to insurance policies and the worthlessness of them in particular to the farmer but also a waste for the detectorist

Cheers "outlaw" I await,with baited breath !!👍

I totally agree with your previous post regarding the insurance companies being in a win win situation as blame would be almost impossible to apportion but it's not absolutely worthless, it's public liability insurance so has never been intended to cover you as a detectorist only accident or injury which is a result of your detecting.
The premiums are relatively cheep even for thousands of members which has always been my gripe as neither the Ncmd or FID's accounts are available to view at least Colin was open in accepting the FID was a business nothing more (those American RV's don't come cheap) but the NCMD are meant to be a representative body ??? Sorry I've got off my soap box now :D

I've got to admit that I haven't looked at either FID or NCMD site in any detail so I don't know if there is a page showing all the terms of agreement.
I do remember thinking, when I first paid for cover,  I would get something in the post. Of course I didn't but never chased it up.
If it's public liability only why do we bother anyway. Most of us who have house insurance have that cover in plenty. When I was still riding and going to different events where we had to show proof of insurance. I asked for and got it in writing that both my horse and myself where covered by this section.
That was with NFU who offer a very good cover for most things. Since loosing my horse I've changed companies and saved us £200 a year. I know we still have public liability but haven't thought to check if it covers us while out with  hobbies. I must check that.

wow i certainly did not want to make this a contavercial subject but its obvious there are different beliefs in insurance.
one post in particualr caught my eye but i thank everyone for answering my question. well sort of answering it lol. the post from the brecon club chairman makes sense and this is why i have already paid to join fid which is ever so cheap compared to my shooting insurance. it only cost me £13 to join using internet but i also had to send a photo to them.  the post from the brecon chairman made sense just like my friend who advised me clubs know fid and mcmd and many dont trust individual insauances as implied by the brecon man.
so my insurarce has been sorted but i am waiting for everything to come back.
another post caught my eye when chef geoff said he never heard of a claim being made well my friend that i have been out with twice now says he was with the swansea claub and a farmer sued their club for leavinga gate open which i think he said caused cows or somethiong to escape and i think he said the club got sued twice but from what i have read here it makes sense that it would be hard to identify an individual unless the person was detyecting by himself on land.
main thing is i have got insurance now connected with metal detecting so and i thank everyone that has posted a reply


edit by me sorry about spelling mistakes and lots of them lol. i work 4 on 4 off and its been a hard day

i dont understand life insurance......if i die i get a big pay out :D

No Nobby!!! When we die(,as we all have to) some body else picks up the DOSH !!,well how frustrating is that lll....LOL!! Merry Christmas 👍🎅🎄

What do you mean "if"?

nobby is hoping they have a cure for death by the time his clock runs out ha ha ha.....if.... ::)

Oh!! Nobby, didn't know you were into Cryogenic's... ???

 I thought they were a heavy rock group!  ;D ;D ;D

 ;D ;D ;D  ;D!!!!

                       A most informative and thought provoking thread; unfortunately I missed it's commencement and it has set me thinking. I wonder why detector dealerships have never contemplated offering FID of NCMD memberships as part of their detector deals, and based on a comment by Val, I wonder if the NFU would be prepared to offer us metal detecting policies.

Its difficult 2 decide which 2 sign up to
Fid or ncmd
Anyone offer any help please

I'm no lover of either but NCMD is the hobbies representative body and you get their quarterly mag/news letter, it's also cheaper than FID which is when all is said and done just a private business selling insurance ;)

How so? The NCMD annual subscription is £6 while FID is £4.50 . . .  ???

How come you get NCMD for £6 it costs me £8 every year

Yes after the first year brcone was asking about initially signing up which is £13 for FID and £8 for NCMD ;)

I don't - I'm with the FID. But I looked on the NCMD website where it told me the subs were £6 - unless I was having a 'Specsavers' moment . . .


Well I intend detecting for as long as the Lord spares me or until there's no more land left in this green and pleasant land of ours. Although with the gov't opening the floodgates for fracking and the accelerated housebuilding program the latter may be sooner than previously anticipated . . .

I'm 65 now and I've got a good 40-odd years left so the FID's sign-up fee will pay for itself in spades by then  ;)

In 40 years i shall be 103 hope the zimmer frames will have catipillar tracks and flashing lights by then, and someone to hold my detector and do the digging  :D

since there's no longer any clubs in the area I live as the nearest was Bangor and that disbanded some years ago what insurance if any would suit my needs and be  best for me ?  ???...hopefully in 40 years there will be Wellys with coils built in the soles so we could just shuffle our way over the fields and receive signals via our built in hearing aids ha ha

Now that made me laugh Raistlain !!!that was really funny 👏👏👏👏👍

Half way there lads; you can get sandals with coils in, for when you go to Turkey and Greece.  ;)