DetectingWales.com

Well you have got to laugh (or cry)

http://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2010/04/05/metal-detecting-more-wiltshire-local-history-being-flogged-off-to-strangers-for-charity/ (http://heritageaction.wordpress.com/2010/04/05/metal-detecting-more-wiltshire-local-history-being-flogged-off-to-strangers-for-charity/)

Quote:

“The church flogged it to a busload of Welsh people for a few pounds each and it’s no longer here."

Well, if these people are so concerned about us "Welsh people" digging up their history, then why aren't they organising their own archaeological digs to find it and put it on display for their own community? They seem quite happy to leave things rotting in the ground, until we, the descendants of Owain Glyndwr decide to cross the border and take it for ourselves as compensation for centuries of English tyranny.

I'm just glad that these little weenies don't represent the attitudes of the vast majority of English folk who are, in my experience, a bloody nice bunch of people.

the author of the article is Nigel Swift,  Chair of the UK-wide group Heritage Action. In a reply to an article written on their website on the 26/03.09, he writes
"We are not archaeologists Mr ********, we are ordinary people".
this brought about a response which was followed soon after another by a supportive comment to Swift's post written by a 'paul the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants'

Coincidentally, he works very closely with another anti-detectorist - paul the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants,  collaborating as co-writer to wite a book entitled "Britain's Portable Antiquity Heritage: Artefact Collecting and the Archaeological Record (Hardcover)  by Paul the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants (Author), Nigel Swift (Author)" -

note the similarity to the portable antiquity scheme title and how this was used as a subtle means to confuse the buyer into thinking it was a work produced by the PAS.

the blurb used to advertise this book [£55 a time] states
"In recent years the discourse on artefact hunting and portable antiquity collection, and their relationship to archaeology in Britain, has become dominated by a particular blend of ideas grown up around the ethos of 'liaison'.

These have had a far-reaching impact and are reflected in almost anything that is currently being written about artefact hunting and portable antiquity collection. This book takes as its starting point an examination of some of the fundamental assumptions on which this model is based and subjects the rhetoric of this discourse to careful analysis.

As a result, a somewhat disturbing alternative picture emerges. After a historical chapter, artefact hunting and collecting are discussed with reference to basic principles of archaeological practice and ethics. The phenomenon is also examined against the background of portable antiquity collecting and the antiquities trade.

The authors then move on to consider justifications offered by the advocates of collecting both in the hobby itself and the profession; the role of the media in forming public opinion; the part played by metal detecting; the use of personal collections as a means of curating Britain's archaeological record; and the role of the Treasure Process and export licences in creating a national heritage from the finds of artefact hunters. Alternative proposals for dealing with the problem are also presented.

 
basically, they are 2 men invovled on a mission, which fails to acknowledge the fantastic work that detectorists do, in recording, researching and recovering artefacts - [more than most archies come to think of it!]


one good point, is that he is allegedly, quite an expert on stained glass

Not strictly true Leighton. Although that side of the border is called England it has strictly speaking not been run by a English monarch ever. The borders we recognise today are only a remnant of the unification of the kingdoms of the late Saxon period. Since this unification we have had no true English bloodline and it is well documented that the most native of all the Home peoples are the Walea ( Foreigners) or Welsh as they were called and I may be wrong but the DNA study of the last millennium has shown that most Welsh Would appear to be Irish and Scandinavian in Origin. True Welsh would account for less than 1% of the population. It made me laugh tonight on BBC Wales at Aberaeron Yacht Club and what the election wants for that part of Wales. Everyone they spoke to had a English accent.

The Welsh -Irish connection is not that we came from Ireland but rather both sets of ancestors came from Northern Spain, The Welsh branch absorbing and slightly changing the language while the Irish settlers seem to have brought their language with them. Both speak a Celtic language with a common ancestor, the Welsh speaking Brythonic, a language spoken in Britain and Gaul and the Irish speak a Goidelic language which is Iberian (spain).

Oh, I already knew some of that, Paul. I was just having a rant.

Good info though, mate.

 ::)

as they obviously read our threads, i have a message for Mr.the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants and co.....i will be on the bus...please come along and have a chat to me , face to face, instead of sniping behind your computer....you will learn that i, and my colleagues, are not the villians you like to make out we are.....byron

The best is Byron he can't, he lives in Poland :-\. He's a long range sniper of the cowardly sort :D

I too have a message for mr the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants, I cant actualy say what i want to, but here is a Pre Watershed version


And further more, may the fleas of a thousand camels infest your armpits (assuming they already dont!)

Salty

So even though he's quite happy to be the self appointed advocate of the British people for protecting their heritage, he doesn't wish to actually live amongst those people or their heritage.

Anyone have details on his tax status?

 ::)

tax status = DODGER !

Ive deleted my last post because it might have made me look a bit Childish lol

"This guy is VILE...........
He will NEVER be swayed. He is a one man crusade against detecting.
Fortunately the pro detecting archaeologists think he is a PRAT, but he is SERIOUSLY against detecting and will do anything in his power, mainly through his blog to discredit us."
but he can only do this if we let him . im fast thining the biggest thret to metaldetecting ive seen in my over 30 years in the hobby is the internet  :-\

Your right he is on a crusade of hate for metal detecting, but part of me is thinking his blog is his only way to fame which he is enjoying, I think that if every detectorist stopped logging on to his blog for 6 month he would cease to exist.

1.  I believe there will be people of all nationalities at the rally so to single out WELSH people smacks of racial
     hatred. If your spouting out racial remarks then if belies that you have a small intellectual capacity and
     clarity of thinking.

2.  As for the remarks that detectorists steal heritage then I would say this:

     How do you think that the Staffordshire Hoard and the Wantage hoard came to light to be enjoyed by
     the British peoples? The Middleham jewel, etc etc etc.

3.  The plain fact is that detectorists have done more for and to preserve the heritage of The UK than
     archeologists. Don't believe me? Just look at the Portable Antiquities Scheme (PAS) database.

4.  The rally will raise quite a bit of money for the church. I don't see National Heritage or similar fund rushing
     to help with cash to preserve our "heritage".

     I would say, don't besmirch people who are forking out their cash for a good cause plus having the expense
     of travelling to and from the event. I'm even losing money by taking a day off work to attend.

5.  The finds from the event will be recorded by government Finds Liaison Officers (FLO) onto the UK database
     along with photo's and so will not be 'lost'. It is simply impractical to display all minor finds in museums.
     Infact many national treasures are not on display but stored away in the cellars of museums. This isn't a lot
     different than a detectorist putting his finds in a display case at home except more people will see it at the
     detectorists home.

6.  Most detectorists don't make any money from the hobby when you take out fees, fuel, buying and selling
     their machines, etc. Most of us do it for the love of it and not to make money.

7.  Not legalising detectoring encourages "underground" activities. Isn't it better to have finds declared and
     recorded rather than hidden because the hobby is illegal such as in Ireland?

8.  If you can't find anything to moan about than a well organised and legal village event,, Mr Barton, then
     you would have, in my opinion, a very low quality of life.

9.  Mr Barton:  Are you making a cash donation to the church? I guess not. All mouth and no substinence. There's
     lots of people like you, unfortunately. It's a good job the UK is blessed with people who will get off their backsides
     and contribute rather than just moan about things.

Very Nicely put young Bob :) Its a shame it will probably be lost on Mr Barton's one remaining brain cell that will no doubt soon die of loneliness ::)
However slightly more tactful that what i have written Lol.
Interestingly i often visit Poland on Business, Perhaps i'll look him up and invite him out for glass of lemonade next time i'm out there ::) ;)

Salty

as a metal detectorist that lives in the real world i can see two sides to a argument ,, yes this is a great hobby, no there are some of us that nighthawk and therefore encourage mr bartons comments but on the whole to take a group of people and label them in the same catergory is not really english {or welsh if you prefer} the best thing to do is ignore such individuals the more you bite the more you will antagonise and for the small amount of us that do operate outside the law ,,,,,all detectorists do not need the bad press.

Just a point of note

the website heritage action is allegedly run by a nigel swift. The contact details for this organisation are on their website. He appears to be the mouthpiece on this side of the channel. One 'misguided' article form their website is below, i'll leave it to you to form your opinion of this website.

Farming as a threat to heritage places

It is widely recognised that deep ploughing and modern intensive farming methods are wreaking havoc with much of our ancient heritage.

In the past few decades our society has been collectively responsible for the destruction of many of our oldest visible monuments, as it is due to the demands of our society that these methods are used.

In some places every trace of our ancient ancestors has been stripped from the landscape. Today there are nearly 3000 nationally important heritage places, often fragile and irreplaceable, that are in danger of being progressively destroyed through ploughing.

These places are scheduled and legally protected. But there is often no real power to regulate or prevent the damage caused by 'routine' cultivation.

For these reasons we strongly support the "Ripping up History" initiative by English Heritage. This aims to bring about an overhaul of current laws to give better practical protection for archaeology, in full co-operation with

finally, a useful analogy is "they are to our heritage what the BNP are to british politics".

How will we know which farms can be ploughed or not without some form of survey.

I suggest that metal detecting the top soil is a good place to start. The archaeologits are too
expensive to do their surveys!  ;D

Like we used to say on another forum I've frequented...

DNFTT!

DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!

 :)

You are suggesting we do a Gordon Brown and ignore the electorate when they ask a question you don't like?  ;D

I say do a Cameron: Smile and give an informed answer.

If you lay down and allow yourself to be kicked you'll be kicked even more. >:(

Neh!

I'm simply saying this guy is nobody, and should be treated as such.

:)

hear hear ,,there are always 2 sides to every argument and we all like to think we know best,,,would like to be a fly on the wall if a detectorist and this guy ever sit down to talk, i think it will just turn into a slanging match as we both sit either side of the fence. 

ha ha,  very well said all you peoples 

I didnt like the away the blog was written.
It made out that a bus full of welsh grave robberys were coming to rape the land of all its riches.

1. He should have a look at my finds pouch.........  he wont find anything coz Id have sold everything on Ebay   :P lol
2. There,ll be english People and locals detecting as well as us 40 plus Plunders of the english heritage.

I think some already said "Are we our own worst enemy"
I think thats probably correct.
We dont know whos checking out all the Detecting forums, and to anyone that doesnt detect it must look as if you all making a fortune !
You only have to look at ebay to see how much money Detectorits are making.

Dont give people who wants to harm us, the rope to hang us with !

 

I've heard about the Bushton rally but not the Foxham one?? When and where please!!

                                 Pat. ;) ;)

Agree with you Phil, you just don,t know who is watching. I have seen enough evidence this last few months that suggests we even have to be wary of our own kind. Mud sticks and some totally irresponsible behaviour from other metal detectorists has made me question once again if I would like to consider a different hobby. All I want to do is be with my family , earn a crust and have some enjoyable days out with friendly like minded detectorists in my spare time. Thankfully I have met some thanks to Detecting Wales but believe me when Mud sticks it can take an awful long time to clean off.

Pat

The Foxham rally is this Fri, Sat & Sun and as I understand is fully booked. It is also in Wiltshire.

Bob

Thanks Bob,

                     Pat.

Perhaps we should include a link to his website. He seems to be "Advertising" the rallies quite well !