A Challenge To Mr Paul the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants Esquire!!!!

[Spooyt Vane]

Sorry Geoff it must be the heat..I recognise all your laudable ttraits from your last post and your deep love of history ..As i share the same interests and i have been involved in archeology,field walking and as antiquarian...I was awarded  a cultural award for my efforts
in metal detecting and field walking......Due respect to you and take my last remarks with a pinch of salt

[Chef Geoff]

  It's good for us old timers to debate things at times Rob as it tends to wash away some of those urban myths that we learned back in the day and help new people coming in to the hobby to think for themselves and question "the chap down the MD club who's been detecting for years" 

[rjm]

Detectorists have only detected only a small percentage of the land in the UK (certainly far less than 10 %)

Land owners/ Farmers/ Contractors/Builders have disturbed far more than detectorists ever will.

There are less than 100,000 detectorists in the UK (many not that active!) out of a population of about 70 million.

The point I make is that the 'disturbance' of finds made by detectorists is minimal to what the larger population and others land workers do by comparison.

I would argue that by and large detectorists are responsible and have contributed more to historical knowledge than not by reporting of finds.  We now have magnificent hoards and other smaller items that are now on display for all to enjoy that we would not have seen if detecting was extinguished.

Most finds are rarely over 8 inches so, normally, it's hardly disturbing any layered archaeology. Time Team JCB's rip this off without a second thought!  (And they are part of the establishment)

Only yesterday I was speaking to someone who's dad was a builder on the Isle of Wight and he has inherited boxes of stuff that his dad had dug during the course of his building work.

Goodness knows how much is found (not declared) / lost / disturbed by Building Industry and people legitimately working the land.

Far more Land  has been, and will be disturbed by non detectorists than will ever be by detectorists.  To actively criticise detectorists, who are largely responsible, is unfair and unwarranted.

An intelligent person would seek to educate and encourage All the public, finding by ANY means, historical items to report them. Encouragement rather than criticism is ALWAYS better!

Why a person not even living in the UK seeks to be so critical of a minority in another country, who do more good than bad, is baffling to me. Misguided and misinformed come to mind.

Oh, how much nicer would it be that all this time and energy be used positively by encouragement rather than negatively criticising.

To spend hours writing negative blogs is time wasted and life is passing him by.

In the nearby city of Newport, thousands (literally)of acres of land are being bull dozed now for house building, etc.

And one man worries about less than 0.1 % of the UK population digging a  small hole!

It's a mad world with mad people in it.

[Val Beechey]

I think quite a few of us, who keep an ear to the ground, can point out areas of interest that are being used for building etc.
In my immediate area there's a field immediately to one side of a 13th cent. church where permission has been granted for 36 houses to be built.  I found the Archaeologists report on the Council Web site. Basically, one Archaeologist has walked around the field and done 'Desk' report which says there are no obvious signs of interest and building permission should be given with a caveat instructing the builders to give special attention the nearest corner to the Church and anything interesting should be reported. OH YEA !!! I can see them stopping work  while they wait around for an investigation. Now I've seen a notice pinned to a gate post in the field next to that one saying that extension and upgrade work is to be carried out on underground sewage systems. (No Archy. report on this field) It should also be mentioned that both these fields are permanent pasture.
I know from my research that a Church probably stood on that site much earlier and the area is one possible site for the Battle of Myned Carn in 1081 (one of the most important Welsh Battles) also Bronze age burials have been found nearby and also Tudor and Civil War activity nearby. Not to mention more recent activity.
What, I wonder, may go unnoticed and never be reported when that lot goes ahead. Is Mr the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants targeting the wrong people ?  I think it's a distinct possibility.

Val

[rjm]

Of course I'm correct, Val! 

[Chef Geoff]

"Comparisons" as they say "are odious" While all the points ref building and development are quite valid on their own, they have little to do with detecting, a little like saying a murder is OK because thousands get killed in a war
My point was that yes it can and does happen that finds are lifted out of context, how many? we will probably never know and in my experience due to the types of terrain I detect on very rarely but it would be irresponsible of us to just say it doesn't happen. As Bob has said we are limited by technology to certain depths dependant to a few factors, conductivity, mineralisation, moisture etc.

One problem I believe is there is ignorance in the archaeological community as to the true power of a metal detector, where they seem to believe that we can detect feet under the ground and not the pitiful inches that is an all too real fact for most of us.
I also wonder at times what parameters are used for the word "context", most of us and myself included translate this to the find laying in a stratified layer of soil which has remained stable since the day the item was lost or buried.
However context can at times seems to be used to relate to the actual site and if so then as long as people are recording then the "context" has been saved.

One good example is here on the Somerset levels there are a great many Roman and Prehistoric sites but because of constant tidal flooding we know that even the Roman ground surface is over 3 meters below the current ground level, on one such site Ferret has found several Roman coins and brooches, now his AT-Pro may be good but it's not that good lol but he has recorded them as so their site context as far as can be is safe.
So When the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants and his friends use the word context it could be a far looser term than we think

[relichunting]

So When the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants and his friends use the word context it could be a far looser term than we think Wink

What friends

[Chef Geoff]

Well there's Nigel and um? a? um? well just Nigel really

[rjm]

Well there's Nigel and um? a? um? well just Nigel really

Made me chuckle!  

If Barking (Mad) the vexatious blogger with incredibly itchy underpants had a well balanced life he'd be too busy 'living' to worry about 0.1% of the UK population (in a different country to him) digging very small holes.

As I said, the UK country and landscape is vastly changing every day by contractors in JCB's and cranes building houses and factories, etc.

Stopping us digging small holes isn't going to keep things in context!!!!!!!