DetectingWales.com

There’s been an update to my blog post on Love Tokens from John Mills … I think you should take a look.

http://www.johnwinter.net/jw/?s=love+tokens (http://www.johnwinter.net/jw/?s=love+tokens)

Most interesting.

Ye enjoyed that john great read

The myth continues ??? I'm one of those that holds no truck with the "love token" idea there are just too many, if every UK based detectorist counted up their William III sixpences the vast majority would be bent in to so called love tokens neither do I ascribe to the counterfeit checking theory as counterfeiting wasn't any greater during his reign and in fact a lot lower than it was in the times of monarchs that came after.
There is no documented evidence of double bending coins which is in itself strange given it's widespread practice in what appears to be a short lived "fashion".

Lets take a look and the much quoted rhyme:-

There was a crooked man _{(this obviously points to the widespread suffering from osteoporosis)} and he walked a crooked mile _{(no town planning back then)}
He found a crooked sixpence _{(love token? yeah right)} upon a crooked stile _{(thank God for the Ramblers Association)}
He bought a crooked cat, which caught a crooked mouse _{(animal welfare was atrocious in those days)}
And they all lived together in a little crooked house _{(overcrowded and substandard housing was rife)}

No I'm sorry it's not a social commentary put in rhyme :-\

There is however a documented custom (superstition) from an earlier age of coins being bent when offering a prayer (wish) to a saint which is only an offshoot of the Romans offering coins in to water and us throwing coins into wishing wells so could they be just lucky charms though even this doesn't really explain why there are so many ???

In her book "Nummits and Crummits : Devonshire customs, characteristics, and folk-lore" published in 1900 Sarah Hewett lists things that bring good luck one of these is
(http://i693.photobucket.com/albums/vv294/Chef_02/lt.jpg)

I've always wondered how the hell they bent them with their fingers! I've tried and it's damn near impossible to get an s shape, they must have used pliers or jammed them in into something to bend them.

just throwing this out there as well ..  could it be that they have been bent just by whatever ? plough , accident etc etc especially if it appears the thinner coins are bent

Yes John and we all still wear flat caps, go to Chapel every Sunday and sing Cwm Rhondda as we march home from a days work down the pit ::)
Is that a veiled insult?
I haven't found that they are more prolific in any one place fair site or otherwise and why would young people be wandering around with sixpences, yes these individuals would have been working and so had money but sixpence would have represented more than a days wage for most and if this was the case then you would expect a greater number of the lower denominations to be present ???

Will I did hear someone suggest that if you put them in a door jamb you can bend them easily ;)

I made a wooden love spoon for my wife to give her on our wedding day. The gift shops around North wales have love spoons in all shapes and sizes for sale, so it would seem that the tradition still continues. Heres a link to a bit of background on lovespoons. http://www.welsh-love-spoons.co.uk/history (http://www.welsh-love-spoons.co.uk/history)
A very interesting read, John, on the love token theory, always enjoy reading your blog posts. Do you have any theories on folded medieval coins? I,ve had a couple off one field which seem to have been deliberately folded and I've seen others recorded by detectorists too.

. Do you have any theories on folded medieval coins? I,ve had a couple off one field which seem to have been deliberately folded and I've seen others recorded by detectorists too.
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We had this come up in our recent talk.  Apparently in the days before pockets, coins would have been bent around a length of twine therefore enabling the coins to be carried more safely if the owner was to poor too even own a purse.
The twine could then be tied around the neck or wrist. Obviously it wasn't foolproof.

I found a William sixpence folded into love token a few weeks ago and it's engraved with the letters JJ. I've got a couple of other ones that are engraved with initials too, any ideas why ?  I've also found a Henry viii half groat made into a love token an a couple of Lizzies similar.

[quote author=Radnor Bandit (Ian)

We had this come up in our recent talk.  Apparently in the days before pockets, coins would have been bent around a length of twine therefore enabling the coins to be carried more safely if the owner was to poor too even own a purse.
The twine could then be tied around the neck or wrist. Obviously it wasn't foolproof.
[/quote]
Sounds very plausible. Thanks for the reply.

Many thanks for a very intreaging and fascinating article. I have been fortunate enough to find an example of this but never understood the story behind it,great bit of research, well done.😁

if i made a love spoon for my wife i know where it would end up , and i know i would end up in the royal glamorgan hospital  ;D ;D ,im a welshman born and breed and i dont know of anyone that makes love spoons ,it may have been a tradition 100s of years ago and maybe some villages still cash in on the past i think more popular down west wales than south ?? , pound notes are the only thing south wales women like  ;D ;D

Here is my favourite one from over the years.

Holed for a suspension loop.

How I would love to return it to the loser.  ;) Jerry.

I have found a few silver love tokens on farms in N Wales - I showed one to a farmer near Caernarfon aged over 100 and he told me that in Wales the young man would smooth a silver sixpence to remove the picture and then fold it. He would give it to a sweetheart after she agreed to be his girlfriend. (no jewellery shops nearby) He said that occasionally they would have his and her initials on it.  He said that they would not be able to meet in the actual farmhouse as it was considered indecent so would meet socially at the point at which the two neighbouring farms met - usually at a gate etc.  If the relationship failed badly she would fling the token over the gate towards the boy's farm - hence the large number we find on farms, especially near roads, paths, stiles and gates.

Rob I was told the same story virtually word for word by a farmer about 10 years ago, I was a believer back then, I said that that was brilliant as I'd often wondered if it was true to which he relied "apparently yes, we had a guy detecting here about 3 years ago and he found one and told me what it was" lol. It just seems a little difficult to believe that all these women are going around throwing the equivalent of £50 notes into fields ??? and if they were doing it 100 years ago where are all the bent Vicy coins ???
It is a "nice" explanation and that's why it will probably remain the accepted one :-\

Geoff, what's value got to do with it.  I threw a £200 ring over the hedge the week before I got married. And that was 1963.
At that point I wouldn't have cared if it cost ten times that. 

Val

(and Yes I got it back after searching next doors garden for most of the rest of the week) 
Just had to chuckle to myself. I was re-living the moment and remembered the ring was followed by an ironing board  ;D ::)

true geoff but ithink it must have gone out of fashion in victorian times because i have never found a viccy love token.but i have found them right back to liz 1st.

 ;D ;D ;D yes but but I've found 3 in one field :D she must have been very unlucky in love and not too bright with finances either :D I bet you could have done with the Safari back then ;)

Ah but this is the great dating trap that we all fall into at some point we can date the latest use but not the first, Lizzy coins would have only been 100 years old during Billy's reign and so could have been bent at any time in the same way that pierced Roman coins are often attributed to the Saxons wearing them hundreds of years later :-\

true as the hammereds were fazed out during his reign we will never know for sure.

I didn't take offence John, they did used to carve spoons, not sure if they still give them as expressions of Love though.

I've got a cartwheel penny with initials stamped into it, worn smooth as well. Like to see someone bend that bugger into an s shape!

i wonder if someone had a vice or simiar tool especially bent into this shape to make these love tokens, that people would pay a nominal amount to someone to prove their affections to their lady?or man maybe??

by that last comment i mean given to a man by a woman.