HORRIFIC

[bristolminelab]

But when bottled water is more expensive than milk something somewhere is wrong?

[Radnor Bandit (Ian)]

My belief is simple :

The farmers shouldnt have any subsidies, but are paid the true market value of their produce whether its meat or cereal.

 

I hope you stand by your beliefs and freely air them when asking the same farmers  for detecting permission.
LOL

[Tafflaff (Rob)]

Horrific my arse  

If joe public knew howmuch money in subsidies these guys get, you wud think very differently.

There is a site on the internet wwhere you can put in any farmers addresss and it will show you howmuch they are paid.

In reality they have either splashed out or taken out huge loans.

There isnt any other industry in this country that gets money thrown at them.

I rest my case  

Ahh now see, that's where facts need to be accurate.  

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19914219

http://labourlist.org/2012/02/how-government-subsidises-big-business/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/8204683/UK-government-agrees-to-subsidise-nuclear-power-companies-prices.html

[Jeff The Wizard]

Well they say Wales is the land of Milk and Honey, now all we need is the Honey, can't wait 

[outlaw]

Most farmers will agree that the whole concept of a subsidies cheque is not the way forward.

Nearly all farmers that I talk too agree that they should be paid the true value of what leaves their farms.

My point is quite simple, if a business can only survive on grant / borrowed money, whats the point to that ?

I must admit I would not like to trade in markets like they do, russian roulette, picking the right time to sell lambs could be the difference of a huge profit to break even or loss !

Supermarket buyers dictating what prices they will pay for livestock, it should be redressed. It should be the manufacturer / farmer calling the tune.

It is still down to the agricultural industry to sort this out, it seem daft to me that everytime there is a slump in a given output the call goes out give us more help !

I make my living from farmers LOL and yes  Ian I do discuss this frequently.  

If you or I received £100, 000 plus per annum it varies plus or minus per  what type and howmuch land and stock you have, would you want it to stop, even small plots of land bring in payments. I would want it to keep coming also LOL

The original thread was dumping thousands of gallons of milk was thought to be a protest vote, when it would be very doubtful that was the case.

 As an edit I stand corrected that there are other industries that get subsidies Rob  lol

Worst case scenario, we need a world WAR !

Food shortages, every farmer would be valued because the nation would be dependant on them for food to survive 







 

[Spooyt Vane]

It comes to the crunch when bottled water is dearer than milk and i live in Isle of Man where the big chain supermarkets have downsized the farming by importing cheap milk,meat,veg,fruit and bread ..The island is not as self sufficent as it should be and recent storms that have meant loss of ferry container service trips to the island ,is now starting to show in the empty shelves in the super markets..God help us we have storms for a long period..

[DEADLOCK]

interesting thread guys good debate

[Val Beechey]

The main thing I found Horrific was the way they were using a slurry tanker to spray the milk over the hedge into the field.
If they want to make a statement then hats off to them but I saw something yesterday that gave me pause for thought.
An enormous white truck covered over with a green tarp' like the ones we saw on the News reports during the foot and mouth a few years back.
I'm not saying that's what it is because we'd have heard about very quickly but it could be TB.  I s'pose I'll hear the details when I see our neighbour who was driving one of the slurry tankers.

Val

[bristolminelab]

It comes to the crunch when bottled water is dearer than milk and i live in Isle of Man where the big chain supermarkets have downsized the farming by importing cheap milk,meat,veg,fruit and bread ..The island is not as self sufficent as it should be and recent storms that have meant loss of ferry container service trips to the island ,is now starting to show in the empty shelves in the super markets..God help us we have storms for a long period..

I know what you mean when shopping in the Isle of man i have noticed a big change there since i first went to the TT races in 1989. I never buy from supermarkets when i am there at the TT  i always buy from local shops and try and buy local produce

[bristolminelab]

Horrific my arse  

If joe public knew howmuch money in subsidies these guys get, you wud think very differently.

There is a site on the internet wwhere you can put in any farmers addresss and it will show you howmuch they are paid.

In reality they have either splashed out or taken out huge loans.

There isnt any other industry in this country that gets money thrown at them.

I rest my case  

Ahh now see, that's where facts need to be accurate.  

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19914219

http://labourlist.org/2012/02/how-government-subsidises-big-business/

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/8204683/UK-government-agrees-to-subsidise-nuclear-power-companies-prices.html

   
Oil industry will be next wanting a helping hand after their inflated prices over recent years, i for one are not shedding a tear for them after the Billions we have paid out over the years. I bet scotland are thanking their lucky stars that the vote did not go the other way

[Chef Geoff]

I think that's a whole different can of worms as 50% of what we pay is tax so when you break down the different aspects of getting the stuff out of the ground, getting it to a shipping terminal, transporting to whatever country, refining it then transporting it to a garage and also giving the garage their cut the profit margin per litre isn't that great but by the shear quantity sold it makes it one of the most profitable out there

[Radnor Bandit (Ian)]

Worst case scenario, we need a world WAR !
Food shortages, every farmer would be valued because the nation would be dependant on them for food to survive  

You obviously havnt done the sums, we do not and cannot produce enough to be self sufficient, WW2 saw the biggest effort to do so with the dig for victory campaign. It didnt work then either.
imports are a fact of life as our diet has become more varied and diverse in the last 50 years.
And that's before getting into the biofuel debate where if we carry on the way it's going, more agricultural land will be under fuel crop than food !

P.S   who shall we fight ?

[outlaw]

I wouldnt want to see any war, it was said loosely. Its not a question of doing sums.

Whether we would be self sufficent or not the country would value our agricultural industry a lot more for its food/ produce, especially if cheaper imports were restricted.

I dont see the point in continually propping up any business with grants / if they are not viable without them.

When the money pot runs out, they crash !

There is a lot of people in this country who continually take money out of that pot, but dont contribute to it, and that also needs to be addressed.

[Spooyt Vane]

Worst case scenario, we need a world WAR !
Food shortages, every farmer would be valued because the nation would be dependant on them for food to survive  

You obviously havnt done the sums, we do not and cannot produce enough to be self sufficient, WW2 saw the biggest effort to do so with the dig for victory campaign. It didnt work then either.
imports are a fact of life as our diet has become more varied and diverse in the last 50 years.
And that's before getting into the biofuel debate where if we carry on the way it's going, more agricultural land will be under fuel crop than food !

P.S   who shall we fight ?

Between the wars we were self sufficent because every acre of land that could be taken into cultivation ,was....Bio fuel will not be taken serious as glut of oil worldwide and cheap oil prices that they reckon could go on for decades.They have been fooling us for years that oil is going run out shortly..nonsense..